Zenith Victorious in Rose Gold - Received!

[Bluemartinifan]

Hi Guys, I have this coming in from a trusted seller, with a 3 day return privelege.
Zenith Victorious, 37mm w/o crown, movement serial (39 mil) dates to the early 50s, seller states cal 12.
Please advise thoughts on the dial, if the movement is a cal 12 and if the caseback is correct. And of course any other thoughts!
Thank you
Russ

 

[wristpirate]

I've not seen a dial like that before, where the star logo sits in that position. Is it the same material as the numerals and markers? In the photo they look rose gold and the star look more of a yellow gold. Could just be the angle of photo

 

[Bluemartinifan]

I agree re the star. That is an odd position.

 

[Modest_Proposal]

Here is another picture of it:

Scripting looks correct to me. Hard to imagine it being a redial. The designations could be for balancing purposes, considering the size of the watch.

Any of the experienced Zenith collectors want to chime in?

 

[Finrod Felagund]

I will use my 3 day retur privilege if I was you ...

1) That would be the first and only Zenith with star at 3 and name printed at 9...

2) I don't think Zenith use the mention "swiss" alone but "swiss made" ... (to be confirmed)

3) hands aren't from Zenith

4) I believe the dial is an early Sporto model and not a Victorious...

 

[Modest_Proposal]

Finrod Felagund

I will use my 3 day retur privilege if I was you ...

1) That would be the first and only Zenith with star at 3 and name printed at 9...

2) I don't think Zenith use the mention "swiss" alone but "swiss made" ... (to be confirmed)

3) hands aren't from Zenith

4) I believe the dial is an early Sporto model and not a Victorious...

1. I'd like to see your records of all the watches Zenith ever made, so that I can compare them. Also, I'd like to know where the redialer got the original factory dies and printing blocks to produce an exact copy of the "Victorious" script - a particularly difficult cursive writing, as well as the Zenith star.
2. It took me approximately 15 seconds to find a second example online (picture attached).
3. I'd like to know how you came to the conclusion that Zenith didn't use literally the most common type of hand type in existence (baton style) and what independent watchmaker installed this exact pair of hands on another watch in the same case (a redial, I know).
4. Where is the sporto specification?

I would advise you and others on this forum do your research before you provide advice on subjects of appraisal.

.

Edited: Jun 14, 2016

 

[Gavin]

I know little about these but here's my 2cts. Fonts look good and I doubt it makes sense for a redialer to refinish it to a Victorious. They are inexpensive watches to begin with. It is also unthinkable that a redialer will reprint and reposition the star to such an unusual and awkward position. Also it doesn't look like there's uneven surface on the dial where the star usually is.

That said, I have also not seen this layout on one.

 

[Bluemartinifan]

Thank you for all your feedback, truly appreciated.
First off, I love the look and size of the watch, that's why I bought it!
I value fact based opinions more than word based opinions.
As Modest Proposal factually points out, I too have found Swiss only dials and similar hand sets (typically on 50s and older dials). And he factually helped me to compare the Victorious script to other examples. So I went on a Victorious script hunt. The script Is Identical to other Victorious script when compared in Macro.
I have not been able to find another dial with Victorious on the 9 side and star on the 3 side. Interesting.
The movement is a 3.9 mil serial, dating it to 50 or 51. Any movement experts here? I would like to confirm if it is a 12 cal or other.
Again, I appreciate the feedback, this is part of confidently owning and enjoying a vintage watch. There is a lot of data and experienced owners out there on Omega and Rolex, vintage Zenith from the early 1950s, not so much.

 

[Bluemartinifan]

Thanks again for your feedback here and via PM.
The Jumbo just arrived and it's nicer on the wrist than in pics. Smooth transaction w Adam at Menta Watches.
Dial is near perfect, 65 year old case in great condition.
I love the warmth of vintage rose gold and those long, slender drilled lugs.
Russ

 

[Modest_Proposal]

Very nice!