Lightning Strikes Five Times - Gold El Primero - G-381

LouS
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MMMD MMMD
I like it, despite the horrendous photography. It looks intact, mild wear, no major dings, dial and furnishings OK.

Quite agree. This one is worth a run and may even be the pick of the litter - certainly better than the Antiquorum piece

dsio dsio
$3k already, clearly some interest in it... Are there any past auction figures for these?

Not that I know, and even if there were, I think they'd be comparable with the Ebay values. These have only lately started to climb in price, along with their stablemates.
 
dxbzenith
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My aim is to add one "prime" El Primero from the '69 - '72 collection. I prefer the round case over the square case, purely personal no offence... Should I try and jump on one of these three or better sit back and await a A386 coming up for sale? What's the opinion of the forum on this?
 
MSNWatch
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LouS LouS
And amazingly, improbably - a THIRD G 381 listing:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/ZENITH-EL-P...156618164?pt=Wristwatches&hash=item3cce25bfb4

this one's a real auction - release the hounds!

As a vintage omega guy and applying what I know in that field, this is the one I would go for of the 3. I like as found one owner watches like this one that hasn't been altered or modified along the years either by other owners or watchmakers. This one looks like a clean, carefully worn example and wouldn't be surprised if it fetched a good price.
 
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MMMD
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MSNWatch MSNWatch
This one looks like a clean, carefully worn example and wouldn't be surprised if it fetched a good price.

Shhhhh... sniper at work. ::cautious::
 
Rdl81
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What about the Italian one nice example right? Just a bit over priced?
 
LouS
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dxbzenith dxbzenith
My aim is to add one "prime" El Primero from the '69 - '72 collection. I prefer the round case over the square case, purely personal no offence... Should I try and jump on one of these three or better sit back and await a A386 coming up for sale? What's the opinion of the forum on this?

Your round case options are the A 386 and the gold references. If you are going to get just one Zenith, you'll want the A 386, but you'll probably end up paying more than most of the gold references. Another case of stainless steel as a precious metal.

MSNWatch MSNWatch
As a vintage omega guy and applying what I know in that field, this is the one I would go for of the 3. I like as found one owner watches like this one that hasn't been altered or modified along the years either by other owners or watchmakers. This one looks like a clean, carefully worn example and wouldn't be surprised if it fetched a good price.

Agree. Goes to show that the principles of vintage watch collecting are generalizable.

Rdl81 Rdl81
What about the Italian one nice example right? Just a bit over priced?

Decent example, very ambitious pricing. 6500USD would be pricey, much less Euros.
 
dxbzenith
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LouS LouS
And amazingly, improbably - a THIRD G 381 listing:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/ZENITH-EL-P...156618164?pt=Wristwatches&hash=item3cce25bfb4

this one's a real auction - release the hounds!

Info received from seller after asking running condition of watch: Quote - I turned the crown and nothing moved. When I pulled the crown out then the hour and minute hands do move. - Unquote. Better stay away or are there reliable repair / restoration services for Zenith?
 
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MSNWatch
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dxbzenith dxbzenith
Info received from seller after asking running condition of watch: Quote - I turned the crown and nothing moved. When I pulled the crown out then the hour and minute hands do move. - Unquote. Better stay away or are there reliable repair / restoration services for Zenith?
Isn't the seller just saying you need to pull the crown out to set the time?
 
MMMD
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dxbzenith dxbzenith
Better stay away or are there reliable repair / restoration services for Zenith?

Everything inside the watch is fixable... for a price. If the movement status remains a mystery, I would brace myself for a potential additional cost of up to $1k (including the service that the watch should surely get).
 
dxbzenith
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MSNWatch MSNWatch
Isn't the seller just saying you need to pull the crown out to set the time?

My question to seller was to check if after winding the crown in the middle of the three "buttons" on the right one could see the hands moving. That's a clear "no" so it seems some (serious?) work needs to be done on the watch to get it running. What is the forum's opinion / recommandation on where to send a vintage El Primero for service / restauration, either in USA or Europe?
 
MMMD
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dxbzenith dxbzenith
My question to seller was to check if after winding the crown in the middle of the three "buttons" on the right one could see the hands moving. That's a clear "no" so it seems some (serious?) work needs to be done on the watch to get it running. What is the forum's opinion / recommandation on where to send a vintage El Primero for service / restauration, either in USA or Europe?

My recommendation would be to NEVER send a watch like that back to Zenith. Too dicey, and you cede too much control. I think the best thing is to find a local guy with a solid reputation, experience with the movement, and the willingness to limit his interventions according to your wishes. The great thing about the Daytona connection is that a lot of watchmakers working for Rolex AD's are pretty comfortable with the 3019 PHC's. I think the special lubrication issues are a thing of the past (but I'm sure the more knowledgeable gearheads will correct me if I'm wrong).
 
LouS
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dxbzenith dxbzenith
My question to seller was to check if after winding the crown in the middle of the three "buttons" on the right one could see the hands moving. That's a clear "no" so it seems some (serious?) work needs to be done on the watch to get it running.

I would direct seller's attention to the left subdial. If she doens't know chronos, she is probably expecting the central seconds hand to move - and it won't of course.

MMMD MMMD
My recommendation would be to NEVER send a watch like that back to Zenith. Too dicey, and you cede too much control.

Emphatically agree. I have sent vintage Primeros to LeLocle in the past, and their proposed "service" was horrifying, including case polish and an option for replacement with a wildly incorrect dial. You won't be able to actually talk to anyone there to discuss details and they'll just give it the "standard." The price was also horrifying - more than double their posted rated on their website.

The bigger topic is that Primero service is always a hassle - many watchmakers don't want to be bothered. LeLocle won't supply parts, which adds to the hassle, but that's not the main issue as I have offered to supply them myself. One day, a watchmaker in the US is going to figure out that there is significant demand among collectors, take a premium for dealing with the parts issue, and do very well for himself.
 
dxbzenith
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LouS LouS
I would direct seller's attention to the left subdial. If she doens't know chronos, she is probably expecting the central seconds hand to move - and it won't of course.



Emphatically agree. I have sent vintage Primeros to LeLocle in the past, and their proposed "service" was horrifying, including case polish and an option for replacement with a wildly incorrect dial. You won't be able to actually talk to anyone there to discuss details and they'll just give it the "standard." The price was also horrifying - more than double their posted rated on their website.

The bigger topic is that Primero service is always a hassle - many watchmakers don't want to be bothered. LeLocle won't supply parts, which adds to the hassle, but that's not the main issue as I have offered to supply them myself. One day, a watchmaker in the US is going to figure out that there is significant demand among collectors, take a premium for dealing with the parts issue, and do very well for himself.

Thanks, great input and feedback. I've contacted the seller pointing out which dial to check! As regards to service : anyone experience with http://www.veldeszenith.nl/? Their claim is being a 100% Zenith specialist? Any other suggestions from the forum which companies to approach for service / restoration?
 
LouS
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I knew it - non-watch people always think chronographs aren't working. It's usually a great chance to get something at a discount.
 
Gavin
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LouS LouS
I knew it - non-watch people always think chronographs aren't working. It's usually a great chance to get something at a discount.
I told him it is bad news for buyers and congratulated him.:D
 
LouS
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Gavin Gavin
I told him it is bad news for buyers and congratulated him.:D

There you go being a gentleman again. :cool:
 
Gavin
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LouS LouS
There you go being a gentleman again. :cool:
I had wanted to use this ::censored:: . But I was appalled ebay does not support it.
 
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